Games we want to see

[Navvarr]

We've got an amazing version of Jetpac for the 8k Vic- how about a full version for a 16k Vic. That would be amazing- surely not beyond the possibility from some talented Vic 20 programmer.

Oh and what about a version of Lunar Jetman- can but dream eh.

[Hanzi]

Does anyone think Gyruss could be made for the VIC one day?

I think it could be done, it´s one of my favs on C64.
If frogger7 could be done, Gyruss should be possible.

[20questions]

would it be possible to port star wars to the vic? the arcade game, not the film, obviously.

I see it this way: 32K ram expansion, PETSCII graphics for the ships. the computer would rapidly flash border colors for the death star explosion.

i'd be willing to make it, but i'd need another programmer (i can make the designs) and about 4 months

[beamrider]

It could, but it wouldn't look great as the CPU isn't powerful enough.

Take a look at the C64 version and think blockier with colour clash. I imagine the frame-rate would be similar as the Vic doesn't have sprites (which I assume they used to draw a few things) but has a lower resolution and slightly faster CPU.

[tokra]

Well, Battlezone proved that vector-graphics are possible on the VIC and the frame-rate isn't too bad. You would only have to draw half as many pixels as on the C64 as well

[Mike]

@beamrider: See also the thread "Games using polygons", and to quote my response from there:

A few pro and cons of VIC-20 compared to C64 for these kind of games:


[+] a PAL VIC-20 is slightly faster than NTSC C64 and VIC-20, with PAL C64 the slowest of the lot. Small advantage in math (translate/rotate/project),

[+] VIC-20 has a smaller bitmap (160x192 vs. 320x200). It's cleared faster, and in general there's less work to do for the graphics routines,

[+] the VIC-20 bitmap can be arranged for a much more nicely addressing scheme. The C64 bitmap addressing scheme is just a PITA for line routines, etc.

[-] the VIC chip can't hold two bitmaps (i.e. two times 160x192, with one as shadow buffer) and switch between them with a simple change of a register for flicker free redraw. You need a fast copy routine for transferring the shadow buffer into the visible screen buffer.

[-] less memory available on the VIC-20 in general. The C64 can use a full 64K RAM, VIC-20 is limited to 40K RAM in total (if we exclude non-standard usage of the I/O area as RAM, and also disregard any banked RAM expansion). Can be alleviated a bit with overlay methods, but ...

For the 160x192 bitmap, I have a ready-made line routine in my drawer, which plots 30000 pixels/second (yes, you read that right: thirty-thousand!). Combine it with a fast "3D engine" *) of any kind and there you go.

@20questions: That being said, requiring +32K RAM for a game yet still only showing PETSCII graphics is guaranteed to impose disappointment on the side of the prospective player - you'd just begin at the wrong end. There are nice examples of PETSCII screenart around though, especially on C64 (look here and here), but if you ever take a look at those, you'll see these also took lots of time to master the skill.



*) I actually think Star Wars on the C64 didn't use any kind of 3D engine to speak of. The shapes were most probably precalculated for different sizes and orientations of the TIE fighters and explosions.

[20questions]

It could, but it wouldn't look great as the CPU isn't powerful enough.

Take a look at the C64 version and think blockier with colour clash. I imagine the frame-rate would be similar as the Vic doesn't have sprites (which I assume they used to draw a few things) but has a lower resolution and slightly faster CPU.

any other computers capable of running it? ti-994/A, COCO? Dragon 32/64 (i have no qualms about using monochrome if it speeds up the gameplay, my only concern is control and visuals, i don't want to sacrifice graphical quality if i don't have to)

[Mike]

any other computers capable of running it? ti-994/A, COCO? Dragon 32/64 (i have no qualms about using monochrome if it speeds up the gameplay, my only concern is control and visuals, i don't want to sacrifice graphical quality if i don't have to)

The issue at hand doesn't become any easier for any of the other contemporary (i.e. 80ies) computers.

Besides, you are even though grossly underestimating the necessary work to be put into such a project, when you speak of 4 months. At your skill level, make that 4 years. You will spend a good part of it leveling up until you even understand what you were asking for.

I know it has been said to you on several other occasions already, but it does not harm to repeat it here: stick to one system first, learn one programming language (and in case you think HTML was a programming language, it isn't!), set yourself small programming exercises - or take them from a book - and then try to solve them.

Doing that will actually lead you somewhere. Not just looking at how games appear to work, and hoping you could 'get away' by just scripting the actions.

[20questions]

any other computers capable of running it? ti-994/A, COCO? Dragon 32/64 (i have no qualms about using monochrome if it speeds up the gameplay, my only concern is control and visuals, i don't want to sacrifice graphical quality if i don't have to)

The issue at hand doesn't become any easier for any of the other contemporary (i.e. 80ies) computers.

Besides, you are even though grossly underestimating the necessary work to be put into such a project, when you speak of 4 months. At your skill level, make that 4 years. You will spend a good part of it leveling up until you even understand what you were asking for.

I know it has been said to you on several other occasions already, but it does not harm to repeat it here: stick to one system first, learn one programming language (and in case you think HTML was a programming language, it isn't!), set yourself small programming exercises - or take them from a book - and then try to solve them.

Doing that will actually lead you somewhere. Not just looking at how games appear to work, and hoping you could 'get away' by just scripting the actions.

any idea where to start? I apologize if i am causing anyone trouble

[tokra]

any idea where to start? I apologize if i am causing anyone trouble

We all started at zero knowledge. No shame in that Just work through the original VIC-20 manual:

https://archive.org/details/Personal_Co ... e/mode/2up

This is a very good guide for beginners and contains some simple BASIC-games as well. Once you have worked through that you will have a much better understanding of the machine and can do some of your own small games. Rome wasn't build in a day, start with something easy to not get frustrated.

[hasseapa]

*) I actually think Star Wars on the C64 didn't use any kind of 3D engine to speak of. The shapes were most probably precalculated for different sizes and orientations of the TIE fighters and explosions.

There are actually two C64 conversions of the original aracde game. The '84 version is probably made of sprites and predefined characters, while the '88 version seems to use line drawings but, as you say, perhaps precalculated to a large extent.

[Noizer]

Impossible Mission, International Soccer, IK + and so on

[Ivanhoe76]

I think that international soccer could be very hard to do on our vic, but something like championship soccer for Atari 2600 https://youtu.be/tS4QiIJdZSU is feasible

[Noizer]

Did you see this!? https://youtu.be/t5nQIsMzfqs
Could it be done on vic20 too, what do you think?

[Noizer]

No further wishes after winter competition of Retrogames!